NO! (Don't shoot me in the face! The Punisher Topic)

[Rollo Tomassi]

so... they used the capunisher uniform on frank in 'ultimate comics avengers 2'. not sure how i'm feeling about that.

It's the Ultimate-verse so you shouldn't be having any feeling one way or the other. other than wondering what that dogpoop stench is and where it's coming from... (hint. it's the longbox that has your post-Ultimatum Ultimate comics in it)

[vynsane]

It's the Ultimate-verse so you shouldn't be having any feeling one way or the other. other than wondering what that dogpoop stench is and where it's coming from... (hint. it's the longbox that has your post-Ultimatum Ultimate comics in it)

i didn't buy ultimatum but i DL'd it - and it was pure shite. that said, 'ultimate comics avengers' vol. 1 was freakin' awesome. we'll see where the second volume leads, but with the capunisher... i dunno...

[anarky]

In fairness, though, it seems like the post-Loeb-fuckup Ultimate universe seems to be all about really doing different things with the alternate reality versions of the characters as opposed to just doing the update thing it seemed to be when it launched. Capunisher is definitely something different. Well, different from any decent 616 Punisher story.

I really think that, with the overexposure of Deadpool and Wolverine (c'mon, an ongoing Spidey/Wolvie team-up book? WTF?), and the complete assabusing of the Punisher, Marvel is getting into some dangerous territory, where Joe Q has no business complaining about the excess and stupidity of the 90s.

Also, I noticed today at FCBD that the Johnny DC titles are $2.50, not a dramatic increase given inflation and rising paper costs, but Marvel's few all-ages offerings were $3.99. Fuck that. My kids can read my old comics or look at this stuff online. When a comic costs almost the same as a full paperback novel at somewhere like Costco or Amazon that offers a hefty discount, and isn't a done-in-one story, fuck no.

[vynsane]

yeah, the $3.99 pricepoint is really starting to hurt, but you get an even deeper discount on subscriptions that way, seeing as how a 12 issue sub has only gone up $1, and a renewal of said 12 issue sub still remains at $19.97. it's a deal that's getting better all the time, amazingly.

[anarky]

Yeah, but how many people who aren't Marvel zombies to begin with would subscribe to a book at $1 per issue without reading an issue first?

[Rollo Tomassi]

Speaking of that shitty Punisher-as-an avenging angel series? I picked up all four issues for less than a buck on FCBD. They had 25 cent comics or fill up a short box for $30. I am now dangerously close to having just about every Punisher comic ever. I'm missing 3 issues from his 'ponytail' series mid 90's, one issue from his Ennis MK ongoing (right before the MAX series), the Ennis War Zone series from a couple years ago, and of course, his first few appearances in Amazing. Oh, and everything after he got turned into a fucking frankenstein.

[anarky]

It appears that, though things might not exactly line up and we know the outcome far before the Frankencastle ends, it will be reversed. Frank's human in Shadowland (or whatever the "Daredevil goes evil" crossover is), which can't take place before Frankencastle because both apparently spun out of the same crossover.

[Rollo Tomassi]

I laughed when Remender was talking about future storylines at C2E2 and said he had the book plotted out to issue 23. I was thinking if the book's sales stay in the toilet they're in (hovoring around 20,000) the book won't make it to issue 23.

When did the editors become so ineffectual?

[anarky]

I dunno, but I hope some editor at DC gets some balls and kicks Grant Morrison in his. Trouble is, the vocal fanboys are eating up this "Dick and Damien" shit.

Batman should either be totally serious or totally camp. Totally serious mixed with superheroic buffoonery doesn't work. And a murderer for Robin is so wrong.

[Rollo Tomassi]

There's an article over at comicbook resources that asks the question "When do you say 'Enough!' to a comic book series?" The comments from many readers are quite entertaining as it degenerates into a a bashing of many of today's big name writers like Morrison, Millar, Loeb, Bendis, Johns, Moore, Frank Miller, etc. And in an unusual diversion, nobody is really defending any of the writers ( or attacking people who are bashing their faves anyway).

http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/20 ... ts-enough/

[anarky]

I decided, after realizing there wasn't a single good DC Universe story after No Man's Land, and a lot of really fucking awful ones, that a giant asteroid hit Earth in the DC Universe around the year 2000 and wiped out humanity. Superman didn't see it coming. Honestly, the retcons and holes in this plot that would be required to make it really make sense are fewer and less extreme than the ones required to make the post-2000 DC Universe make any sense.

I mean how the fuck do you make Dick Grayson Batman? They tried it before. He failed. And don't get me started on fucking Batwoman. I don't hate her because she's a woman, or because she's a lesbian. I hate her because the retarded "girl puts on a Batman costume and fights crime and is immediately accepted by the rest of the Batman family" was done already with Batgirl and sucks no less the second time.

[Rollo Tomassi]

I was one of the few people that said if they HAD to replace Batman with one of his protoges, make it Jason Todd.

First of all, let me say, I think bringing back Todd was a good idea (in theory , if not in execution). Making Jason Todd one of Batman's rogues and having that failure in his face, and in Nightwings face, and Tim Drake's face would open up lots of intersting conflicts and stories for many years. Yes, you probably piss of the 3,683 who voted to kill him off 20 years ago. And maybe 5% of those people are still reading comics on a regular basis. So it sucks for those 40 people. But otherwise, its an intersting []option[/i] for storytelling.

So when it became clear that Grant Morrison was going to kill off Batman and nobody at DC had the stones to tell him no. Who do you replace him with? Well, as anarky pointed out, Dick already tried...and NOBODY cared! Why? Because Dick is already accepted by everyone who is in the Batman mythos. Where's the story in him teaming up with Superman? Or any member of the Justice League. They all think highly of him and have his back, filling these big boots he's stepped into. And he's already stepped out of Bruce's shadow and become his own hero. There's no regret or angst there. And any that has been created for this story arc is artificial.

Jason Todd on the other hand. It would be an uphill battle for him all the way. Dick would always be in his face. Tim would be in his face. Superman would be in his face. There would be some real drama there and only Bruce (via some post-mortem DVD will and testament) would think this was the way for Todd (and Bruce) to redeem himself. And maybe he would fumble the ball sometimes and people would die. But dammit, there would be DRAMA in the attempt.

Having Dick Grayson be Batman is just a fucking copout.

[anarky]

I don't disagree with you on Jason, but I would've picked Tim to fill Bruce's cowl. He's apparently an adult now. Leave Damien completely in his little last panel of an Elseworlds book, make Tim Batman, and maybe Stephanie can be Robin. Or, in a twist, Dick feels like he should help Tim out, and he goes back to being Robin.

Hush could've been the last good Batman story, had they had the balls to leave the villain as Jason. Hush (the character) turned out to be pretty worthless.

It's pretty sad that, along with there being so few decent new characters overall, there wasn't a single truly great new Batman foe introduced between Bane (who debuted in 1993, just after Harley) and the Music Meister (October 2009, on a kids' show, goddammit).

[anarky]

Oh, and the death of Jason Todd was rigged. Maybe not intentionally, but consider the facts:

Jason died by a margin of about 70 votes.

Batman mentions in The Dark Knight Returns mentions that Jason Todd had been killed (I think it either identified the Joker or left it ambiguous).

The Dark Knight Returns was published in 2006. "A Death in the Family" was published in 1988.

So there was already a story from two years earlier, which wasn't known to be an alternate future at that point, where Batman had confirmed that Jason Todd had died as Robin.

Wonder if that either influenced votes, or maybe kept some more cynical people from voting.

No biggie, of course. I like the way things played out after his death, and Tim would never have existed if Jason hadn't died.

[Rollo Tomassi]

There are only really a few great Batman villains. They are the ones that are the antithesis of one of Batman's traits.

Joker is the dark reflection of Batman's own psychosis.

Two-Face is the dark reflection of Batman's addiction to justice.

Riddler is the dark reflection of Batman as a detective/crimanalist.

You can go on, Catwoman, Penguin, etc. There are a few more, but the rest are just wankers to fill in issues until one of the good ones shows up again. And even then you aren't guaranteed to get a good story if the writer doesn't understand the relationship between Batman and his nemesis.